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Maniac with Saw [Forum] » Maniac with Saw » Suggestions » Some Balance Suggestions (some suggestions regarding gameplay, mechanics, etc)
Some Balance Suggestions
chuky-jr
Victim
Дата: Monday, 02.01.2012, 20:06 | Message # 1


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Maniac is considered too weak and have some major flaws :
- i got an Axe and Maniac went silent mode and turn off his saw, then i walked up to him and hit him 2 times and he is dead. For a killer, Maniac's health is considerably low (100, equal to victim). Can be buffed up a bit.

- regarding the last example, Maniac could have ran away, but in MOST of my games, our team can easily chase down Maniac in 4 minutes (fully equipped with weapons, 3 to 4 person), and we do some simple blocking, and he is dead.

- at most, Maniac's first skill to pull the Victim away from group is useless if the whole Victim already near him, whenever Maniac tries to pull one, the rest of the team beat him up to death. This ability also seem to have small collision, but that's just a personal opinion. This should have more buff, like a small stun, or high chance of giving bleeding, etc.

- Maniac's Rage skill is good to finish up a Victim bleeding to death, trapped in Net, etc. But if this is considered an AoE / Crowd Control ability for Maniac, it doesn't work well. 2 Victim with weapons is enough to beat Maniac to death, since they can jump around when Maniac swung his axe (and i notice this game has no 'Motion Buffer Range' for any unit), a lot of can easily pull this stun and be a bait for Maniac, while the others tried to pin him down, i know Maniac is supposed to have some flaw but this is too major, i proposed for a bonus silence effect (to prevent jump) / slow effect and bigger AoE for Rage, or maybe add some more damage too since i find it funny i don't even bother to run away from Maniac since i know he can't hit me well even in close range.

- i propose a wider camera view for Maniac.

- better resistance for fracture, severe bleeding, etc. (i don't know if Maniac already has this)

- maybe Maniac should have growth for his abilities/attributes (+10 HP/MP/MS per kill, etc)

For Victims :
- i just don't really get how the barricade ability of Victim will be much of use since it costs a lot of MP alone, and when i'm grouped, none of us bother to create barricade and just went off to kill Maniac, but it is just me i think.

- i don't get how to use Feign Death either, usually i use it in a haystack to confuse Maniac for a few minutes since the selection circle is blocked by those stacks.

For Ghosts :
- this is the annoying part, the game gets prolonged because of these guys, a group of ghosts (7-8) sucking Maniac's MP will just slow down Maniac's movement while we know the 9th person will die anyway, there is no way a good Maniac can be taken out by a lone Victim. Maybe tweak their MP drain? can only drained by 1 ghost?

For Items :
- not much to add, just don't know the usefulness of lighting up lamp using Matches/Lighters

For Mechanics (this might include World Editor) :
- can we have -1 Unit Selection for Victims and Maniac? this will make both parties will get harder to notice each other, even if they are selected, currently the selection circle is too blatant and obviously gives off the position of each unit. i'm not sure about items selection though, looking for items through selection-dragging is already hard for me IMO.

- Camera seems somewhat flawed, sometimes when i pressed right/left, it will continously rotate endlessly and needed to be stopped using up/down. And also how do you watch replay from each of player's perspective? i can't choose any player other than the server.

- the place where we can click in the view is noticeably small, for some reason i have better selection-dragging techniques when the items is in my right/left part of view than in top or bottom view.

- the area for checking whether there is anything in the Jump landing point seems to big, i think it needs some tweaking.

- i think whenever a Victim already went through the cliff using a Rope, Sixth Sense shouldn't registered it as a 'a Victim' anymore since Maniac can't reach him. Some people just love to camp under the cliff that it makes the Sense is wasted to be used on them. Or maybe just let the Victim automatically saved when he already went off the cliff.


Message edited by chuky-jr - Tuesday, 03.01.2012, 02:18
 
Unseen
Victim
Дата: Friday, 13.01.2012, 20:24 | Message # 2


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29.12.2011
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Totally agreed with the Ghosts part, although I think ghosts shouldn't be able to drain Maniac at all... the more people die the harder it gets to find the last few ones, and ghosts draining maniac will make that a lot harder than it already is

Also something should be done about escaping... I've played a number of games where people find a rope or a key and escape in like 1 minute from game start. I myself have spawned a few times so that both the boat and a fitting key were right next to me and escaped in 2 minutes with like 4 other people. That's too much about luck. I think there should be a delay of 5 min or so from game start before victims will be able to escape.
 
Trespasser
Victim
Дата: Saturday, 14.01.2012, 16:50 | Message # 3


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I agree with all the stuff presented above, esp. the jump stuff.

I've also some suggestions that i think should be presented more detailedly but given the fact im on a shitty smartphone i wont get much into detail for now:

-some maniac-specific items -make the chainsaw he starts with 'rusty' as it wont start after 3-12 tries(the current one) and have some maniac-only chainsaws dropped around - this or randomize the maniac chainsaw type at the start, whether its rusty or in good condition(that starts from the first try + some minor boosts), with the 2nd saw having smaller % to get. This allows the maniac to be silent and still not fail like an old man using an ATM.
also some small stat stamina\movespeed items could be added, along with a sight-range item like binoculars.
-maniac needs a shorter cd of the molotov cocktail(or w/e its called) for crowd control or escaping. Rage could also give more sight range and possibly some speed to make it efficient. also you might let maniac select victim and see items n name on sixth sense.
-map stuff: a well in the 'town' that replenishes a certain amount of hp/mp and has a decent cooldown. maybe add a(smaller) underground layer - sewers with more entrances, yes it sounds pretty vague.
Have the farm gallows(the ramp ones) - get a small far-sight -giving building(call it infrared binoculars or whatever) for victims, ie show the maniac for five secs - should be up on the cliff as its a perfect dead-end and trap, so you risk much and possibly screw yourself to be able to look.

It may seem there are too many boosts for maniac and too few for victims(ever considered dual wield for one-handed weapons?), but the main idea of this game is to be slaughtered or to escape, and killing the maniac has to be a rare situation with proper preparation and circumstances, not 2 lucky wankers butchering him everytime on a Sunday walk.

I'm expecting feedback on these suggestions, lets have some more activity here so when Fukuro gets back he'll have something to add to this already very addicting map.


Message edited by Trespasser - Saturday, 14.01.2012, 16:56
 
Unseen
Victim
Дата: Sunday, 15.01.2012, 22:54 | Message # 4


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Yea I agree maniac should be more powerful, he dies way too often. But the greatest problem right now is the GHOSTS draining maniacs stamina
 
Fukuro
0 != NULL
Дата: Tuesday, 24.01.2012, 12:45 | Message # 5
Quote (chuky-jr)
i got an Axe and Maniac went silent mode and turn off his saw, then i walked up to him and hit him 2 times and he is dead. For a killer, Maniac's health is considerably low (100, equal to victim). Can be buffed up a bit.

I will increase his defense (probably 10% damage reduction).

Quote (chuky-jr)
and i notice this game has no 'Motion Buffer Range' for any unit

Actually it has, but very small (32).

Quote (chuky-jr)
better resistance for fracture, severe bleeding, etc. (i don't know if Maniac already has this)

He has. Some fractures are even impossible for him (right arm and jaw fractures).

Quote (chuky-jr)
i don't get how to use Feign Death either, usually i use it in a haystack to confuse Maniac for a few minutes since the selection circle is blocked by those stacks.

For example, if Maniac it too hasty and don't smash corpses, you can find a pile of real corpses and lay among them (of course, maniac must not see you while you doing it).
It's pretty useless ability, but can be used for fun biggrin .

Quote (chuky-jr)
this is the annoying part, the game gets prolonged because of these guys, a group of ghosts (7-8) sucking Maniac's MP will just slow down Maniac's movement while we know the 9th person will die anyway, there is no way a good Maniac can be taken out by a lone Victim.

Absorb will be changed. The most important is that Maniac will be immune to it.

Quote (chuky-jr)
can we have -1 Unit Selection for Victims and Maniac?

I can't set "-1" for this field.

Quote (chuky-jr)
Camera seems somewhat flawed, sometimes when i pressed right/left, it will continously rotate endlessly and needed to be stopped using up/down.

There is nothing I can do with it..

Quote (chuky-jr)
And also how do you watch replay from each of player's perspective?

There is no way for it.
Because WC3 doesn't share LOCAL data between players in multiplayer.

Quote (chuky-jr)
the place where we can click in the view is noticeably small, for some reason i have better selection-dragging techniques when the items is in my right/left part of view than in top or bottom view.

It's because of HP/MP bar =(
However you can minimize it to increase screen clicking-area wink

Quote (chuky-jr)
the area for checking whether there is anything in the Jump landing point seems to big, i think it needs some tweaking.

I don't think there is any way to optimize this. It's not the "jump" flaw, but WC3 path-map.
Just look how everything is so fucking squarish near cliffs:


Quote (Unseen)
I've played a number of games where people find a rope or a key and escape in like 1 minute from game start. I myself have spawned a few times so that both the boat and a fitting key were right next to me and escaped in 2 minutes with like 4 other people. That's too much about luck.

I agree. I will think about possible solution for it.

Quote (Trespasser)
-some maniac-specific items -make the chainsaw he starts with 'rusty' as it wont start after 3-12 tries(the current one)

I will change this "3-12" thing anyway (which is annoying, I know), no need for an item.

Quote (Trespasser)
also some small stat stamina\movespeed items could be added

Adrenaline syringes will restore stamina.

Quote (Trespasser)
maybe add a(smaller) underground layer - sewers with more entrances, yes it sounds pretty vague.

I do have some thoughts for underground for a long time biggrin .
Just didn't have much time lately.

Quote (Trespasser)
the main idea of this game is to be slaughtered or to escape, and killing the maniac has to be a rare situation with proper preparation and circumstances, not 2 lucky wankers butchering him everytime on a Sunday walk.

I agree.

Quote (Trespasser)
I'm expecting feedback on these suggestions, lets have some more activity here so when Fukuro gets back he'll have something to add to this already very addicting map.

I apologize for my long inactivity, I had some problems with studies.
Although I was constantly checking forums and reading everything.
 
diegokopo
Victim
Дата: Friday, 27.01.2012, 21:10 | Message # 6


HP:

XP:

Exp: 80
Registration date:
24.10.2011
Gender:
Quote (Fukuro)
Adrenaline syringes will restore stamina.


This Will Work For the maniac too? because, a maniac with adrenaline will be powerfull

Quote (Fukuro)
I can't set "-1" for this field.


And The negative Values... but with negative values will unable to attack? O.o

Quote (Fukuro)
I will increase his defense (probably 10% damage reduction).

More defense, mm, I think this is ok, because some maniacs don't know much of the game and is easy to kill them, With this the maniac is more powerfull, now One player can't Defeat the maniac so easy! Good Idea


Message edited by diegokopo - Friday, 27.01.2012, 21:11
 
Fukuro
0 != NULL
Дата: Sunday, 29.01.2012, 19:38 | Message # 7
Quote (diegokopo)
This Will Work For the maniac too?

Sure.

Quote (diegokopo)
because, a maniac with adrenaline will be powerfull

He need to find it first biggrin
 
Maniac with Saw [Forum] » Maniac with Saw » Suggestions » Some Balance Suggestions (some suggestions regarding gameplay, mechanics, etc)
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